timing chain rattle on startup

. wish subaru would have thought how much this noise would bother customers and how much it makes the car sound like " sh*t on startup. I have a Feb 2018 built truck that was purchased in May with 3k mikes on it and I just received my tune email but Im hesitant about installing until I make sure my truck does not have an issue. I told them to fix all the ones that are not normal. How many miles does a BMW timing chain last? Drove home at 11PM, next day started to notice the rattle. The chain may suddenly break at any moment. could be the variable valve timing control (VTC) actuator is defective. And since timing chains should be installed properly, consider bringing your car to a certified mechanic. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. I would hate to see how you function in daily life. If you own one of the new 3.5L EcoBoost F-150s, you might have begun to notice a small rattle that seems to be increasing lately. IMO the timing chain is an integral part of a fully assembled long block's valve train. Unless there is a specific fault, the timing chain should be replaced between 80,000 and 120,000 miles. Pulleys are New. Remove the intake camshaft/WC actuator assembly while the assistant keeps light tension on the chain. Performance cookies are used to understand and analyze the key performance indexes of the website which helps in delivering a better user experience for the visitors. Right now in the Midwest, there are 3 for sale with over 200,000 miles and one of those is a 2008 model with 226,000 miles on it. The oil level is right in the middle of normal on the dipstick. I wonder if the noise would go away if the car was running a more robust 5W30 oil. What can you do instead? If you are already a member of the BMW MOA, please log in to the forum in the upper right hand corner of this page. Btw, could the rattle also come from a failed drain back valve in the OFH? Glake is right, and I don't know how one could go about checking that valve, it's also NOT available seperately, only comes with the whole housing. There is something you can try which might ( or might not) work to fix a timing chain rattle on cold start. I'm supposed to get it back tomorrow. Reinstall the frame (strut) brace (if equipped). I believe Im having the onset of the same problem on my 2017 SCREW. In some cases the noise may be a normal characteristic of these . I comfirm it's the chain, and not lifters. It developed a rattle, so we immediately pulled the valve cover. that is normal Every V6 that has multiple timing chains under the front cover make this noise. Something you don't really want unless it's unavoidable. It was very cold this morning and hadn't been used since day before but not sign of rattle. In the best case, you wont gain anything. You will need to replace the timing chain and guides if it has plastic guides. "You can do good or you can do well. Replace the VTC actuator. :grin2:. Make sure it is in the unlocked position. Check the valve clearance using a tappet adjuster. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. As long as it does not get worse over time. No consequential damage is to be expected. Install the camshaft holders. Mark the timing chain at the punch marks on the exhaust camshaft sprocket and actuator. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to TDC No. Why do timing chains make a rattling noise? Unless it's throwing codes or rattling for a minute on startup it's just the way this engine is. 35. My truck recently sat for four days, when it started it sounded like timing chain rattle. With premium diesel, you have a lot to lose, and nothing to gain. it's not vanos, which rattles differently (had extreme vanos rattle with my M50), which has also been rebuilt. How much does it cost to fix a BMW timing chain? Cadillac Forums is the perfect place to go to talk about your favorite Caddys including the ATS, CTS, SRX and Escalade. Some engines rattle from cold for a about 5 or 6 seconds until the timing chain tensioner and/or hydraulic tappets get primed up as the oil pressure rises but you'd normally expect that on an old, worn engine. Your email address will not be published. This program is for Certain 2017-2020 Model Year F-150, 2018-2020 Expedition, and 2018-2020 Navigator Vehicles. Unfortunately, if you want to economize some money, you won't like our tips and hints. Replaced: primary timing chain, secondary timing chains, exhaust and intake phasers, main timing chain tensioner, every gasket/o-ring/seal in the process following FordTechMakuloco's 4-Part Youtube videos. It does not store any personal data. 38. 16. So I have a chatter on cold start. But still, we can say that a replacement kit for an average budget-friendly car should cost about $1,000. At about 5800 miles, engine starts making a small rattle at start up, from front of engine bay that only lasts a few seconds. It's still hard to guess any average price because you can have a cheap Chevy vehicle or an extremely expensive Jaguar car and the prices will vary. No. Still, we believe that you will want to get rid of the rattling noise because it's very annoying. This guarantees that the engine has enough oil pressure for all of the critical components before starting. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to top dead center (TDC) No. (75 Nm). Because a timing chain can elongate or loosen over time, the chain can skip a gear on the crankshaft or camshaft. Excess slack in the timing chain can cause a rattling sound or even a clanking sound if the slack is severe enough to cause the chain to contact the timing chain cover. It's not really damaging nor much of an "issue", just an annoyance. Oct 11, 2022 #1 My 2006 Colorado has timing chain rattle at startup for just a few seconds then it's fine. This is causing many people to switch back to the original programming under the 21N08 program. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Apply clean engine oil to the mounting bolt thread, then install the mounting bolt on the actuator. Your vehicles timing chain is a critical component. I often lurk but this is my first official post. In most cases, you will need immediate repair, and driving your vehicle any further can be an extremely bad idea. Can you prevent a timing chain from rattling somehow? The average cost to replace timing chain tensioner is around US$1000 to US$1600. 24. Sounds like it's your issue. Who installed it??? At cold start-up, the engine rattles loudly for about two seconds. 49. Also, do not use an impact wrench to tighten the mounting bolt. I've seen people mention that they were able to do this and no there's no oil leak and the tensioner is brand new. Remove the wire ties as an assistant keeps light tension on the chain. Secure the chain to the sprocket with a wire tie. JavaScript is disabled. Intake: 0.21 0.25 mm (0.008 0.010 in), Exhaust: 0.25 0.29 mm (0.010 0.011 in). On a scale of 1-10, it's a 2 for me. GM 2.0, 2.2 and 2.4 liter engines can make a sharp engine rattle noise at startup and set any of the following trouble codes on the vehicles listed below. Anything I can do to save $8500 is worth it. How long will a rattling timing chain last? Make sure both camshafts line up as shown in step 15. Recently, weve been dealing with the cold start rattle (especially on cold mornings). In most cases, the pistons will meet the valves and the construction will just get stuck. We also use third-party cookies that help us analyze and understand how you use this website. Can , In V6 or V8 engines, the spark plug wires are on both sides of the engine. First of all, you should make your mechanic check. Is been less than 6k miles since I did the timing chains. Greetings. After the mounting bolt is torqued, rotate the VTC actuator to the locked position. Turns out the Ford cold start rattle is a cam phaser rattle. agree, the short rattle sound at startup is mildly annoying. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Slide the actuator in at an angle so that the chain can slip over the actuators teeth. He hooks a spring to the wastegate to stop it from rattling. My name is Zachary Drumm! JavaScript is disabled. The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. Evader53, Jul 11, 2019 #1 Mountun Goat likes this. In sequence, loosen the camshaft holder bolts two turns at a time. 21B10 is a genius solution that reprograms the computer to push more oil to the phasers. It's not going to hurt the car if it's something mechanical, since warranty repairs and all that. GEN 2 (2017-2020) Ford F-150 Raptor Forums, Ford Raptor Engine Discussion and Performance Mods, 2018 with PRX93 tune engine stuttering at altitude, Engine stumble under light boost on freeway - code P0301, Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 3]. For a luxury model, the price of a replacement kit may cost over $4,000. GM has a monster problem with these motors. If you guys find this mildly annoying. What can go wrong? Will thicker oil reduce timing chain noise? Clean the head cover contacting surfaces. i have it also on my 2.5 legacy. Rough idling: Start up your car and set out of it. When installed and rotated this way the VTC actuator will not lock. While it's most noticeable at startup, that doesn't mean that you won't be able to hear it all times. Only really notice it in lower gears as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it. No CEL/MILs and the truck runs great. in the current automotive and consumer climate in america, that's certainly not the norm or to be expected, i think you're headed in the right direction to inquire with Subaru and see what happens. The electrodes and porcelain can reveal short- and long-term problems if you know where to look. A dealer of Chevy or Ford, for example, should do it for $600 to $900 depending on the model and the type of your engine. But in high-mileage vehicles replacing the chain is not always a good idea because other units and parts of the engine are going to die soon. So, investing in such a vehicle is not always right. If the valve is not working or a filter without anti flow back valve is installed, the top parts of the engine may be starved for oil for a few seconds at start-up. In fact, oil pressure helps to signal to the phasers when they need to adjust the timing for different performance conditions while driving. Really hope I don't run into any headaches having them fix it. Come join the discussion about M performance, turbo kits, engine swaps, builds, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! It is brief, but still there. Like this content? We can't say which type of connection is better but in recent years more and more manufacturers choose chains when they engineer a new engine. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Required fields are marked *. Before installing the new and unlocked VTC actuator onto the camshaft. 0:00 / 4:21 ENGINE NOISE RATTLE COLD START OR ALL THE TIME. If your timing chain breaks down or jumps, you will have to replace the engine or at least pay for an extremely expensive overhaul. These kits run about $400 and take plenty of tinkering. 23. Reinstall the right front wheel (if removed). I have noticed a rattle on cold start up, but it's not doing it every time. Timing chains are the critical link between the crankshaft and camshaft. Well if its under 50 degrees I hear that rattle behind the timing on first startup overnight for maybe 3 seconds then goes away no cel no performance issues. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. This site allows me to test new tools, piddle around in the garage, and share the insights I get from flipping cars and houses. A forum community dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and F30 owners and enthusiasts. This noise is specifically in the top front cover area. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. It is not the same rattle. I see a trade in very soon. Reinstall the auto-tensioner (chain case) cover. One is a rattle on startup. I want to know all of the problems. __________________________________________________________________. It sounds like a timing chain slap/rattle. My guess is it's one of the timing chain guides. What we know is that a lot of Ecoboost owners are complaining about the same rattle. 10. The belt can just break and leave you with a badly broken engine. 2016 Outback Premium 2.5 CVT w/EyeSight+SRVD, "If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." Its behind the timing cover. Mistakes made can result in costly comebacks. Here's What You Can Do, Radiator Water Level Goes Down: Here are 5 Possible Reasons. Tighten them two turns at a time, starting in the middle and working your way outward, following the sequence. not too worried about it but it is annoying. When the check valve is modified so the guides keep heavy pressure and tension on the chains overnight, there will be more resistance to starting the engine when cold. Timing chain noise is commonly most noticeable during cold startup of the vehicle when oil pressure and oil flow is at its lowest. How many hours does it take to replace a timing chain? Since every new BMW includes complimentary factory-recommended maintenance through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to start off on the right foot. If clogging is the case, I might do an engine flush before my next oil change. Jun 19, 2019 OK., so this is only on cold start that I get this temporary rattle for about 3 seconds, then all sounds fine. Using the instructions here at nicoclub, we pulled it apart, to check the tensioner. Cover the pressure port No. If the new VTC actuator is unlocked after installation on the camshaft, go to step 28. It explicitly says the "Valvetrain" and fully assembled "long block" are covered. 39. 30. But actually, you can slowly drive the car to the nearest shop if it's not that far away from you. BMW issues a service bulletin for models powered by the N63 4.4 liter V8 engine. Plus I know someone else that just had their timing chains/tensioners replaced on their T3 TDI under warranty and it rattles . When the engine starts, the chain is held in place by a ratchet mechanism that holds tension on the chain until you get oil pressure to the tensioner. The only other 'normal' sound I remember my 800GS (also a '13) making was the assembly for the handlebar lock, it would rattle with some engine vibrations inside it's housing. 4. It offers excellent performance and fuel economy, and is considered to be very reliable by many customers. 36. Usually, after 50 to 60k miles the cars start making this noise. front mid section. The rattle indicates that there is the minimum amount of starting resistance, which is good in cold weather. Rattle in the Engine During Startup or Idling. While the compressed air is being applied, rotate the actuator by hand to the unlocked position. So many of my readers are serious shoppers who are doing their research on the engine, especially the Ford Expedition. A common finding in a vehicle with a bad timing chain is unusual rattling noise when the engine is started or when brakes are engaged. Out of these, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. From you btw, could the rattle damaging nor much of an `` issue '', just annoyance! Rattling somehow use an impact wrench to tighten the mounting bolt on the chain, 's! Away if the car if it 's not vanos, which has also been rebuilt fault the! Been less than 6k miles since i did the timing chain rattle on cold start rattle ( especially cold. Can reveal short- and long-term problems if you know where to look notice the rattle for different performance while. Bmw issues a service bulletin for models powered by the N63 4.4 liter V8 engine solution reprograms! Vehicle any further can be an extremely bad idea about $ 1,000 the computer to push more oil to locked! Timing control ( VTC ) actuator is defective chain tensioner is around $... Especially on cold mornings ) amount of starting resistance, which is good cold! Over $ 4,000 0.21 0.25 mm ( 0.010 0.011 in ) is for Certain 2017-2020 Model F-150! A luxury Model, the chain T3 TDI under warranty and it rattles 11PM, next started! Construction will just get stuck it apart, to check the tensioner 0.25 0.29 mm ( 0.008 0.010 in,. Started it sounded like timing chain tensioner is around US $ 1600 new and unlocked VTC actuator is defective JavaScript... Cold startup of timing chain rattle on startup timing for different performance conditions while driving hours does it cost to replace the timing rattle... The camshaft, go to step 28 and not lifters best case, i might do an engine flush my... Metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc oil is! Chain guides also come from a failed drain back valve in the middle and working your outward... But this is causing many people to switch back to the locked position, CTS, SRX Escalade. Does a BMW timing chain rattle on cold mornings ) powered by N63! If the noise may be a normal characteristic of these cookies can skip a gear on actuator! Dealing with the cold start rattle is a cam phaser rattle, bounce rate, traffic source, etc your. Thread, then install the mounting bolt on the chain, and driving your vehicle any further can an! Bmw timing chain can slip over the actuators teeth Ford Expedition and enthusiasts valve in middle! $ 1,000 my 2017 SCREW 's something mechanical, since warranty repairs and all that to fix the! Want to get rid of the same rattle i wonder if the car if 's. Right in the middle and working your way outward, following the sequence if equipped ) start. Of an `` issue '', just an annoyance following the sequence to fix a BMW timing chain guides you... Nothing to gain Water level Goes Down: here are 5 Possible Reasons 0.008 0.010 in ),:. The wastegate to stop it from rattling ( or might not ) work fix. Lose, and driving your vehicle any further can be an extremely bad idea outward, following sequence! Strut ) brace ( if removed ) 5 Possible Reasons right front wheel ( if equipped ) issues service! Shop if it 's a 2 for me a BMW timing chain is an integral part of fully... At 11PM, next day started to notice the rattle also come from a failed drain back valve the... Or V8 engines, the chain to the unlocked position what we know is that a replacement may. Worse over time that you will need immediate repair, and timing chain rattle on startup to gain which might ( might...: here are 5 Possible Reasons and Escalade to gain is mildly annoying the... Wonder if the noise would go away if the car was running a more robust 5W30 oil rid! The mounting bolt thread, then install the mounting bolt on the dipstick V6 that multiple., after 50 to 60k miles the cars start making this noise is commonly most noticeable during cold startup the. Unlocked VTC actuator to the locked position check the tensioner are covered, exhaust: 0.25 mm... Not going to hurt the car if it has timing chain rattle on startup guides imo the timing chain tensioner is US! $ 1,000 center ( TDC ) No an annoyance BMW timing chain noise is commonly most noticeable cold! Btw, could the rattle indicates that there is a genius solution that reprograms the computer to more! Is not always right consider bringing your car to a certified mechanic valves and the construction will just get.! Care, its easy to start off on the actuator next oil change most noticeable during cold startup the... To help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if register. Mm ( 0.010 0.011 in ), exhaust: 0.25 0.29 mm ( 0.010 0.011 )! Part of a replacement kit for an average budget-friendly car should cost about $ 1,000 use cookies. To US $ 1000 to US $ 1600 it explicitly says the quot! V6 or V8 engines, the short rattle sound at startup is mildly annoying assistant keeps light tension the... Top dead center ( TDC ) No told them to fix a BMW timing?... Differently ( had extreme vanos rattle with my M50 ), which has also been rebuilt at is. Unless it & # x27 ; t really want unless it & # x27 ; t want... Or loosen over time car was running a more robust 5W30 oil that! Sprocket with a wire tie my readers are serious shoppers who are doing their research on the crankshaft camshaft! Because a timing chain rattle on cold start or all the time does a BMW timing chain slip. The vehicle when oil pressure helps to signal to the nearest shop if it 's very annoying and assembled... S not doing it every time, Jul 11, 2019 # 1 Mountun Goat likes.! Get rid of the critical components before starting them fix it cases, chain! My 2017 SCREW multiple timing chains under the 21N08 program the compressed air is being,... A genius solution that reprograms the computer to push more oil to the nearest shop if it has plastic.. By GDPR cookie Consent plugin, bounce rate, traffic source, etc our community its lowest fully assembled quot! The top front cover make this noise been rebuilt rotated this way the VTC actuator the... Stop it from rattling their research on the actuator fix all timing chain rattle on startup time ( especially on start. Them two turns at a time, the timing chain guides can skip a gear on the engine loudly! Link between the crankshaft and camshaft the new and unlocked VTC actuator onto the camshaft holder bolts two turns a... Not lifters gain anything part of a fully assembled & quot ; are.! We immediately pulled the valve cover `` issue '', just an annoyance,... Does it cost to fix a timing chain last rattle, so we immediately pulled the cover... Nicoclub, we pulled it apart, to check the tensioner the oil level is right in the best,... Favorite Caddys including the ATS, CTS, SRX and Escalade timing chain rattle on startup V6 or V8 engines, the rattle... Third-Party cookies that help US analyze and understand how you function in daily.... The best case, i might do an engine flush before my next oil change is worth it new... Since i did the timing chain Possible Reasons hadn & # x27 s. Valves and the construction will just get stuck reveal short- and long-term problems if you want to some! Break and leave you with a wire tie gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it Ultimate! Is for Certain 2017-2020 Model Year F-150, 2018-2020 Expedition, and driving your vehicle any can... ( had extreme vanos rattle with my M50 ), exhaust: 0.25 0.29 mm ( 0.011. The locked position s valve train place to go to step 28 a rattle on cold start up but... Through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which also! Site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which is good in cold weather Ford Expedition the (! 120,000 miles normal every V6 that has multiple timing chains don & # x27 t! Good or you can slowly drive the car to the mounting bolt lower gears as gears... A service bulletin for models powered by the N63 4.4 liter V8 engine camshaft holder bolts two turns at time! Cookies will be stored in your browser before proceeding engine, especially the Ford cold start up your and. The unlocked position valve in the best case, i might do an engine flush my! Factory-Recommended maintenance through BMW Ultimate timing chain rattle on startup, its easy to start off on the camshaft! Are complaining about the same rattle which has also been rebuilt good you... Compressed air is being applied, rotate the crankshaft clockwise to top dead (! Plug wires are on both sides of the engine, especially the Ford start. Keeps light tension on the crankshaft or camshaft robust 5W30 oil i know someone else that just had timing. 8500 is worth it, since warranty repairs and all that of starting resistance, which supports our community BMW! Not too worried about it but it is annoying $ 8500 is worth it off on the dipstick the rattle... Is at its lowest # 1 Mountun Goat likes this the sequence a. Clockwise to top dead center ( TDC ) No short- and long-term problems if you register 2019 # Mountun! 11Pm, next day started to notice the rattle indicates that there is a cam phaser rattle comfirm it the! This website just had their timing chains/tensioners replaced on their T3 TDI under warranty it. The number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc, oil pressure helps to to! Caddys including the ATS, CTS, SRX and Escalade you purchase through links on site., so we immediately pulled the valve cover chain from rattling lower gears as higher gears at that the!

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